Marijuana

allison

Well-Known Member
#21
^^^^^^^ i agree. but i also agree that alcohol and other impairing drugs with little to no medical value should be much less available.
That's just the thing. It doesn't matter if it's of medial value or not. People have the right to choose what they want to put in their bodies, and live with the consequences. Doesn't matter if it's weed or meth, it's not our place to take it away from people. The nitty gritty of things like the dangers of making things like meth is best dealt with by other laws protecting property rights, things to do with child safety, and local statutes to protect the value of the neighborhood. If you wanna get really messed up, that's up to you, and I have absolutely say, no matter what it is.

Sure, I understand that a lot of this is entangled in other issues, like ObamaCare, and maybe there could be reductions in benefits for more hardcore drugs (I'm trying to be a bit realistic here on policy implementation).


but when those consequences start affecting other people, then there's an issue. You can't give someone their kids and husband back who were killed by a drunk driver, even by throwing the person in jail for the rest of their life. And a drunk person isn't going to listen to a law that says don't drive drunk - it impairs your thoughts. If people were more responsible, sure. But America? Nah. Not right now at least.

You bring up a really good point. Sure, put whatever you want into your body, but when your actions caused by that stuff harms other people, then we have a problem.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
#22
I realize it's not that harmful of a drug, but if it is legalized, then where is the limit?? Are we then going to want to legalize cocaine ?? That's my issue but idk





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Cocaine and marijuana are on completely different spectrums.


Meh. Legalize it all. It's a victimless crime.

But it's still a crime


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
^^^^^^^ i agree. but i also agree that alcohol and other impairing drugs with little to no medical value should be much less available.
That's just the thing. It doesn't matter if it's of medial value or not. People have the right to choose what they want to put in their bodies, and live with the consequences. Doesn't matter if it's weed or meth, it's not our place to take it away from people. The nitty gritty of things like the dangers of making things like meth is best dealt with by other laws protecting property rights, things to do with child safety, and local statutes to protect the value of the neighborhood. If you wanna get really messed up, that's up to you, and I have absolutely say, no matter what it is.

Sure, I understand that a lot of this is entangled in other issues, like ObamaCare, and maybe there could be reductions in benefits for more hardcore drugs (I'm trying to be a bit realistic here on policy implementation).


but when those consequences start affecting other people, then there's an issue. You can't give someone their kids and husband back who were killed by a drunk driver, even by throwing the person in jail for the rest of their life. And a drunk person isn't going to listen to a law that says don't drive drunk - it impairs your thoughts. If people were more responsible, sure. But America? Nah. Not right now at least.

You bring up a really good point. Sure, put whatever you want into your body, but when your actions caused by that stuff harms other people, then we have a problem.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
But it's not really a good point. Plenty of activities have side effects that endanger others. By the same logic, we should ban driving, people with lower income from having dependent, owning guns and other risky activities. It's just invalid. It doesn't suddenly become legal to do things that actually are illegal and actually ARE infringing upon others personal freedoms if you're high. It's just illogical to ban drugs for the side effect you actually don't like.
 

Whispered

Well-Known Member
#23
I realize it's not that harmful of a drug, but if it is legalized, then where is the limit?? Are we then going to want to legalize cocaine ?? That's my issue but idk





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Cocaine and marijuana are on completely different spectrums.


Meh. Legalize it all. It's a victimless crime.

But it's still a crime


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
^^^^^^^ i agree. but i also agree that alcohol and other impairing drugs with little to no medical value should be much less available.
That's just the thing. It doesn't matter if it's of medial value or not. People have the right to choose what they want to put in their bodies, and live with the consequences. Doesn't matter if it's weed or meth, it's not our place to take it away from people. The nitty gritty of things like the dangers of making things like meth is best dealt with by other laws protecting property rights, things to do with child safety, and local statutes to protect the value of the neighborhood. If you wanna get really messed up, that's up to you, and I have absolutely say, no matter what it is.

Sure, I understand that a lot of this is entangled in other issues, like ObamaCare, and maybe there could be reductions in benefits for more hardcore drugs (I'm trying to be a bit realistic here on policy implementation).


but when those consequences start affecting other people, then there's an issue. You can't give someone their kids and husband back who were killed by a drunk driver, even by throwing the person in jail for the rest of their life. And a drunk person isn't going to listen to a law that says don't drive drunk - it impairs your thoughts. If people were more responsible, sure. But America? Nah. Not right now at least.

You bring up a really good point. Sure, put whatever you want into your body, but when your actions caused by that stuff harms other people, then we have a problem.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
But it's not really a good point. Plenty of activities have side effects that endanger others. By the same logic, we should ban driving, people with lower income from having dependent, owning guns and other risky activities. It's just invalid. It doesn't suddenly become legal to do things that actually are illegal and actually ARE infringing upon others personal freedoms if you're high. It's just illogical to ban drugs for the side effect you actually don't like.
we ban driving for those who have no knowledge of it, require many documented (and by virtue, many undocumented) hours of driving, people are exposed to it their whole life. however, the first time you get high, it's new. you (may) have nobody there at some point when you're high.

i could see alcohol and marijuana being legal, but controlled. such as, you have to go through classes or something, like driving, and guns, and skydiving, and other risky activities.
 
#24
I realize it's not that harmful of a drug, but if it is legalized, then where is the limit?? Are we then going to want to legalize cocaine ?? That's my issue but idk





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Cocaine and marijuana are on completely different spectrums.


Meh. Legalize it all. It's a victimless crime.

But it's still a crime


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I realize it's not that harmful of a drug, but if it is legalized, then where is the limit?? Are we then going to want to legalize cocaine ?? That's my issue but idk





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Cocaine and marijuana are on completely different spectrums.


Meh. Legalize it all. It's a victimless crime.

But it's still a crime


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
^^^^^^^ i agree. but i also agree that alcohol and other impairing drugs with little to no medical value should be much less available.
That's just the thing. It doesn't matter if it's of medial value or not. People have the right to choose what they want to put in their bodies, and live with the consequences. Doesn't matter if it's weed or meth, it's not our place to take it away from people. The nitty gritty of things like the dangers of making things like meth is best dealt with by other laws protecting property rights, things to do with child safety, and local statutes to protect the value of the neighborhood. If you wanna get really messed up, that's up to you, and I have absolutely say, no matter what it is.

Sure, I understand that a lot of this is entangled in other issues, like ObamaCare, and maybe there could be reductions in benefits for more hardcore drugs (I'm trying to be a bit realistic here on policy implementation).


but when those consequences start affecting other people, then there's an issue. You can't give someone their kids and husband back who were killed by a drunk driver, even by throwing the person in jail for the rest of their life. And a drunk person isn't going to listen to a law that says don't drive drunk - it impairs your thoughts. If people were more responsible, sure. But America? Nah. Not right now at least.

You bring up a really good point. Sure, put whatever you want into your body, but when your actions caused by that stuff harms other people, then we have a problem.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
But it's not really a good point. Plenty of activities have side effects that endanger others. By the same logic, we should ban driving, people with lower income from having dependent, owning guns and other risky activities. It's just invalid. It doesn't suddenly become legal to do things that actually are illegal and actually ARE infringing upon others personal freedoms if you're high. It's just illogical to ban drugs for the side effect you actually don't like.
we ban driving for those who have no knowledge of it, require many documented (and by virtue, many undocumented) hours of driving, people are exposed to it their whole life. however, the first time you get high, it's new. you (may) have nobody there at some point when you're high.

i could see alcohol and marijuana being legal, but controlled. such as, you have to go through classes or something, like driving, and guns, and skydiving, and other risky activities.
What about stoves? What about the risk of a relaxing hot bath? How should we handle the risk of electrocution from the home? Do we ensure people know they must throw away frayed wired? How about lawnmowers? You could easily cut off a limb using one, yet they are in schools, homes and so on, and are buyable without any license. They're all considerable, and could easily kill you, and have absolutely no forced mechanism to make sure you don't hurt yourself with them. We don't get hurt or hurt others with them generally, because we're not idiots, and they are a part of our lives, and no one's afraid to talk about the danger.
 

Whispered

Well-Known Member
#25
I realize it's not that harmful of a drug, but if it is legalized, then where is the limit?? Are we then going to want to legalize cocaine ?? That's my issue but idk





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Cocaine and marijuana are on completely different spectrums.


Meh. Legalize it all. It's a victimless crime.

But it's still a crime


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I realize it's not that harmful of a drug, but if it is legalized, then where is the limit?? Are we then going to want to legalize cocaine ?? That's my issue but idk





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Cocaine and marijuana are on completely different spectrums.


Meh. Legalize it all. It's a victimless crime.

But it's still a crime


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
^^^^^^^ i agree. but i also agree that alcohol and other impairing drugs with little to no medical value should be much less available.
That's just the thing. It doesn't matter if it's of medial value or not. People have the right to choose what they want to put in their bodies, and live with the consequences. Doesn't matter if it's weed or meth, it's not our place to take it away from people. The nitty gritty of things like the dangers of making things like meth is best dealt with by other laws protecting property rights, things to do with child safety, and local statutes to protect the value of the neighborhood. If you wanna get really messed up, that's up to you, and I have absolutely say, no matter what it is.

Sure, I understand that a lot of this is entangled in other issues, like ObamaCare, and maybe there could be reductions in benefits for more hardcore drugs (I'm trying to be a bit realistic here on policy implementation).


but when those consequences start affecting other people, then there's an issue. You can't give someone their kids and husband back who were killed by a drunk driver, even by throwing the person in jail for the rest of their life. And a drunk person isn't going to listen to a law that says don't drive drunk - it impairs your thoughts. If people were more responsible, sure. But America? Nah. Not right now at least.

You bring up a really good point. Sure, put whatever you want into your body, but when your actions caused by that stuff harms other people, then we have a problem.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
But it's not really a good point. Plenty of activities have side effects that endanger others. By the same logic, we should ban driving, people with lower income from having dependent, owning guns and other risky activities. It's just invalid. It doesn't suddenly become legal to do things that actually are illegal and actually ARE infringing upon others personal freedoms if you're high. It's just illogical to ban drugs for the side effect you actually don't like.
we ban driving for those who have no knowledge of it, require many documented (and by virtue, many undocumented) hours of driving, people are exposed to it their whole life. however, the first time you get high, it's new. you (may) have nobody there at some point when you're high.

i could see alcohol and marijuana being legal, but controlled. such as, you have to go through classes or something, like driving, and guns, and skydiving, and other risky activities.
What about stoves? What about the risk of a relaxing hot bath? How should we handle the risk of electrocution from the home? Do we ensure people know they must throw away frayed wired? How about lawnmowers? You could easily cut off a limb using one, yet they are in schools, homes and so on, and are buyable without any license. They're all considerable, and could easily kill you, and have absolutely no forced mechanism to make sure you don't hurt yourself with them. We don't get hurt or hurt others with them generally, because we're not idiots, and they are a part of our lives, and no one's afraid to talk about the danger.
but the *lawnmower* itself isn't the cause of you killing/hurting someone. if you smoke, and then decide (because you're impaired) that it'd be a good idea to do something illegal, then you smoking is at fault.
 

LooseSeal

Well-Known Member
#26
Looking at the replies, it seems like this thread has turned into a discussion of the "nanny state" and when the government is crossing the line. Ultimately, it is a judgment call on the part of legislators. I believe the government has the right to regulate any substances or practices which are considered a public health risk. How do we know what's a PH risk? Again, that's up to the government to decide, but we should take into account studies, epidemiologic data, research, etc. Right now, there is no substantive evidence regarding the dangers of marijuana, and I believe the bans on pot are more socially constructed. The same cannot be said about drugs like meth, which have some very clear dangers.
 
#27
Looking at the replies, it seems like this thread has turned into a discussion of the "nanny state" and when the government is crossing the line. Ultimately, it is a judgment call on the part of legislators. I believe the government has the right to regulate any substances or practices which are considered a public health risk. How do we know what's a PH risk? Again, that's up to the government to decide, but we should take into account studies, epidemiologic data, research, etc. Right now, there is no substantive evidence regarding the dangers of marijuana, and I believe the bans on pot are more socially constructed. The same cannot be said about drugs like meth, which have some very clear dangers.
Except it's clearly not. The intent isn't to make public health better. It's to gain political points on whatever the arbitrary issue of the day is. It's not up to the government to decide my unhealthy decisions, and is no where clearly defined as a constitutional function of the government. It's easily debatable whether it's the government's place in the first place, without a constitutional amendment.
 

LooseSeal

Well-Known Member
#28
Looking at the replies, it seems like this thread has turned into a discussion of the "nanny state" and when the government is crossing the line. Ultimately, it is a judgment call on the part of legislators. I believe the government has the right to regulate any substances or practices which are considered a public health risk. How do we know what's a PH risk? Again, that's up to the government to decide, but we should take into account studies, epidemiologic data, research, etc. Right now, there is no substantive evidence regarding the dangers of marijuana, and I believe the bans on pot are more socially constructed. The same cannot be said about drugs like meth, which have some very clear dangers.
Except it's clearly not. The intent isn't to make public health better. It's to gain political points on whatever the arbitrary issue of the day is. It's not up to the government to decide my unhealthy decisions, and is no where clearly defined as a constitutional function of the government. It's easily debatable whether it's the government's place in the first place, without a constitutional amendment.
I agree with you about how politically motivated these regulations are, and many of them are influenced by heavy lobbying. However, these regulations on harder substances do serve a purpose. Drug use is more than just a "decision" on the part of the individual; when you look at statistics of hard drug use divided by race, income, location, etc., it becomes evident that there are multiple socioeconomic factors and pressures that drive these decisions.

That being said, I do think that drugs should be decriminalized but still remain illegal and heavily regulated - instead of throwing users of illicit substances in jail, we should be offering treatment and support to address the cause of the addiction. Portugal in particular has done this. The "War on Drugs" in the U.S., on the other hand, is a complete and expensive mess that unfairly targets certain racial and ethnic groups, costs the taxpayers money, and overburdens our criminal justice system.

Going back to weed, though, I support full legalization and regulation only in terms of things like age and quality (such as making sure it's not grown with dangerous pesticides, etc.).
 
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