Best Guest Room revision?

[Quicksilver]

Here's some food for thought - everyone who wants BGR to be chosen based on building abilities and what not, what is the criteria for the scoring then? Do you know what the criteria is? How can you be sure that the judges (staff choosing) will not be bias?

Perhaps having popular guest rooms is a way to let the public decide what a BGR is. Also, this encourages the owner of the room to spend time welcoming players into their BGR entry - not just sending in a written application and letting fate decide the outcome.

Sure it could turn into a popularity contest, but hey it could also not be right?

 

[Lindsay]

Here's some food for thought - everyone who wants BGR to be chosen based on building abilities and what not, what is the criteria for the scoring then? Do you know what the criteria is? How can you be sure that the judges (staff choosing) will not be bias?

Perhaps having popular guest rooms is a way to let the public decide what a BGR is. Also, this encourages the owner of the room to spend time welcoming players into their BGR entry - not just sending in a written application and letting fate decide the outcome.

We don't know the criteria. We didn't know it when the competition originally started and we could send in our rooms. We don't know it now where any room can win. The only criteria we do know for a fact is that is has to be open to the public. If the judges are going to be bias changing the way to submit your room won't change that. The way the competition is run now or with the suggested revisions the judges could be bias against or for any player because at the end of the day they decide. It's not like we're voting out of a top 10 or anything.

If that was the reason why BGR was changed in the first place then we as a community failed. The public doesn't go into a room and make it popular because the room is well built. They go into it because it's a trade room or their friends are there. It's very rare to find a room with more than 10 users that isn't, or started out as, a trade room. I've made my rooms into a trade room just to get them popular because that's the only way to do it.

 

[Lost]

I think a lot of people are just annoyed that they never know if they have been judged, whereas by sending in an email they knew they were in the running but now they could spend many hours in a room and not know if they have been considered or not.

 

[PlayerOne]

I'm sorry but i do respectfully disagree:

There will always be bias in judging. This is the case in every competition that MyVMK has run, not just including Best Guest Rooms. But here are a few points:

Submitting rooms via form/email could be set up to be anonymous. Now of course popular rooms will stand out but if whoever is judging rooms does not know who built which room, that is a big step forward. This is nearly impossible to do in the current system of staff visiting rooms.

I'd rather have staff be bias over the content of the room rather then popularity. You say it could turn into a popularity contest? I disagree. It already has. I don't like to use myself as an example, but i am going to for this one: I wake up for work around 10:30 am and get home, if I am lucky, around 9:30, sometimes more around 10:30pm, 5 days a week. By the time i do get home and make myself some dinner and am able to get on MyVMK (If i don't crash and fall asleep right when i get home), not a lot of people are on because it is so late, and even if i did want to spend the time i had sitting in my guest room, it is very unlikely any staff are awake to visit. Now i am not asking for freebies or handouts. I completely understand and support the idea of those who are more involved in the game to be able to achieve more, as in cases of earning credits or attending host events. And Best Game room already covers that "activity" preference already. You can't have a successful game if you don't open it frequently. But i thought the point of Best Guest room was to see which rooms were built, for lack of a better word, the best? Why should availability and popularity be taken into account? And before you say it hasn't already, you have no idea how many times I've gone in to certain players guest rooms that are at the top of the list (No names here. And it's not only one specific person anyways) and frequently see staff in there. Nothing wrong with that in my eyes, staff are allowed to be a part of the game and partcipate, but it gives popular and well-known players a huge advantage because they know they will be seen by staff.

Perhaps having popular guest rooms is a way to let the public decide what a BGR is.

People who hang out in guest rooms in VMK do it for a few main reasons:

It is a game room (Which would be eligible for Best Game, not Best Guest)
It is a trade room (Which is not eligible for Best Guest)
Their friends are in the room

There are exceptions, obviously, but those are few.

Also, look at the poll. The vast majority of people disagree with the current system. I'm not saying the popular opinion is the one that is right, but when 80%+ of any population agree that something should be changed, that's a pretty clear sign that something is wrong.

 

[Lindsay]

Bringing this back up

 

[HOST_Absolem]

People who hang out in guest rooms in VMK do it for a few main reasons:

It is a game room (Which would be eligible for Best Game, not Best Guest)
It is a trade room (Which is not eligible for Best Guest)
Their friends are in the room

Who ever said a trade room couldn't be nominated? I for one know I've nominated some great looking trade rooms.

 

[Lost]

Who ever said a trade room couldn't be nominated? I for one know I've nominated some great looking trade rooms.

I've heard a lot of people say in game that staff have said trade rooms couldn't win BGR.

It's nice to know that's not true. Don't know where the rumour started, but I've heard it from a lot of people, and a lot of people expressly make sure they don't include trade room in the title for their rooms because of it.

 

[Karalora]

I voted for all three possibilities. I think the best way for the hosts to find the best room is to have as many methods available as possible, whether that's hopefuls submitting their own rooms, people submitting a room that isn't theirs but that they are impressed by (I can think of at least one room I would submit on another's behalf), or the hosts themselves discovering one.

 

[PlayerOne]

We decided that this would be a better change. No, trade rooms will not be considered. However, we are hoping this would mean that players would get together to make sure a room that deserves BGR, should get it. A best guest room, not only in my eyes but those of our hosts, believe it to be something that should be worked for. Anyone can make a room but getting the kingdom to be in support of it.. is a bit more of a challenge. We know it is going to be a challenge but we want to try something different. Getting a picture of the guest room and actually experiencing it, are completely different. It is a trial run so don't fret! We hope this is something we can use to bring players together

-Snow

To answer your question @HOST_Absolem, a previous member of staff said it, in regards to the changes made to Best Guest Room in September 2014. To the best of my knowledge, there has not been an official post laying out the rules about the monthly contest by staff. Maybe one would be helpful? I've been under the impression for the past 8 months that trade rooms were disqualified for BGR (As they should be in my opinion. If you are judging the rooms which are "popular" or are attracting players, Trade rooms require little to no effort to be made popular. Allowing trade rooms to win BGR would simply mean everyone who wants a good chance at winning BGR would make their room a trade room). It's for that reason i thought that the rule on trade rooms was made.


And may i also take the time to say that Snow has said in more than one post that this new method was a trial. Well, it's been tested for 8 or so months, you see the vast majority of the community is opposed to the new system. If it was really considered a trial, why have the changes been kept? At least have an official poll (Since not everyone visits the idea forum) to see the general consensus of the community.

Again, it is a trial. If it does not work out, it will be removed. However, you cannot judge how it will occur if you do not try it out.

-Snow

 

[HaleighRose]

In my opinion, I think the players including myself just want to know if our rooms have been entered into the contest or not. If we know, then we have a better attitude to keep it open for others to see. And if haven't been entered then we know to up our building game and try again. It can be a private message, and if we tell others about being entered we get DQ'd if you want to keep it secret.

I still don't understand why it has to be so secret it the first place. Like staff says it's a "community" and love to see people in rooms, then why not have the community vote on the rooms. Makes way more sense than what were doing now. It'll get people together and trying in my opinion.

 

[Lindsay]

To answer your question @@HOST_Absolem, a previous member of staff said it, in regards to the changes made to Best Guest Room in September 2014. To the best of my knowledge, there has not been an official post laying out the rules about the monthly contest by staff. Maybe one would be helpful?...

...And may i also take the time to say that Snow has said in more than one post that this new method was a trial. Well, it's been tested for 8 or so months, you see the vast majority of the community is opposed to the new system. If it was really considered a trial, why have the changes been kept? At least have an official poll (Since not everyone visits the idea forum) to see the general consensus of the community.

I think you've put my reply into the most polite, respectful, and perfect wording imaginable, so I'm just going to quote you lol

And I'm still not a fan of how it has to be a secret. If I've been entered for a room I'd like to know that way if I don't win I at least know that it wasn't because I didn't try to have it open enough.

Clearly us users have no idea how this is run and even though Host_Absolem is trying to help us all, her help is contradicting the things previous staff members have said. An official rules page would do be a great deal of help to the community as we would know what is true and what isn't true anymore.

 

[GodricGryffindor]

Just because that other thread was closed doesn't mean that one MyVMK BGR winner didn't copy an original VMK BGR winner 90% of the way. It still happened. Just throwing that out there. And that's only one example of a copied room. I can justify others with or without certain tools staff have that us players do not. I'd rather not get into those details though because I don't want to say specifically who didn't deserve to win what.

Whether or not the BGR system changes entirely, something needs to happen about the above problem... and I'm not saying to revoke any winners at all. I'm just saying for the future winners.

 

[HOST_Absolem]

Ok, I think everyone is missing the point of this whole BGR thing. This is NOT a competition (If you choose to make it that way, that's on your part, not ours). We are not asking people to sign up then go crazy building something. What are we doing? We're asking regular, everyday players, to make creative rooms and open them up! Just like people should be doing daily! That's all there is to it. It's us, staff, going around and RANDOMLY visiting players rooms. Whether there is only 1, or 25 people in the room, we are always looking. There is NO signup, therefore there is no need for a public list of who has been entered. This whole thing is pretty much just a behind the scenes thing that we do.

Below is from the newsletter. It states the only rule. Build a room!

"Create a Great Guest Room! Get Recognized!
Player created Guest or Game Rooms demonstrate originality in concept and design. Our judges are looking for creativity, so try using traditional items in different and unique ways. Rooms are judged by MyVMK Staff every month and selected from player rooms."

 

[HOST_Absolem]

one MyVMK BGR winner didn't copy an original VMK BGR winner 90% of the way. It still happened.

I said this in the other thread. Just because a player sees one room before they see another, does not mean they are right. We look at more rooms than you think, and we also know when those rooms were built. Trust me, we see lots of copycats. But we know who's came first.

 

[PlayerOne]

I'd agree with you if you were simply showcasing creative rooms that you have come across, but you are awarding prizes (Including the highly sought after Castle Suite room) to someone you "randomly" visit. People build creative rooms all the time, but either get on when no staff are on in the wee hours of the night, or are simply too busy with work/life to spend the little time they do get onto VMK sitting in an empty room, hoping a staff member randomly visits. When you add prizes into the mix, that when it becomes something that people will compete for.

 

[GodricGryffindor]

I said this in the other thread. Just because a player sees one room before they see another, does not mean they are right. We look at more rooms than you think, and we also know when those rooms were built. Trust me, we see lots of copycats. But we know who's came first.

I don't think you understand. The room was built like 6 years ago. I am right.

 

[Youtherevmk]

People build creative rooms all the time, but either get on when no staff are on in the wee hours of the night, or are simply too busy with work/life to spend the little time they do get onto VMK sitting in an empty room, hoping a staff member randomly visits. When you add prizes into the mix, that when it becomes something that people will compete for.

I honestly don't care at all, but this right here is a really valid point...

 

[Zelena]

It this is not a competition then maybe there shouldn't be prizes that are rare and highly sought after.

 

[Lindsay]

This is NOT a competition (If you choose to make it that way, that's on your part, not ours)...I said this in the other thread. Just because a player sees one room before they see another, does not mean they are right. We look at more rooms than you think, and we also know when those rooms were built. Trust me, we see lots of copycats. But we know who's came first.

You aren't reading what godricgyffindor is saying. What he's saying is that somebody copied a room from the original vmk best guest room winners. Not from a user's room here on myvmk. It's plagiarism not being a "copycat."

And you can't say it isn't a competition when the prize for winning best guest room is the most wanted and valuable room in the game. If the prize was just the bgr award pin and a few credits people would care a whole lot less and the rooms chosen would look a lot less like an award winning room. But we all want the castle suite guest room whether to have as a room or to trade and that's why we all go crazy competing for them. Nobody wants the prizes to change, but for something that's not a competition you sure are giving away a prize worthy of a hardcore competition.

And you didn't acknowledge what playerone quoted from Snow. Is it because you don't know? If that's the case involving somebody else who does know is a good idea. I hope that's not just going to get ignored.

 

[HOST_Absolem]

To answer your question @HOST_Absolem, a previous member of staff said it, in regards to the changes made to Best Guest Room in September 2014.
Well, it's been tested for 8 or so months, you see the vast majority of the community is opposed to the new system. If it was really considered a trial, why have the changes been kept? At least have an official poll (Since not everyone visits the idea forum) to see the general consensus of the community.

Call that lack of communication on our part then, because I was never told that, and I've seen others nominate them as well. This will be something brought up the the others. I, personally, don't see why a trade room couldn't qualify it was designed well enough.

Again, just because players aren't happy with the way it is going, does not mean it isn't more effective on our side. The main complaints i've seen on both of these threads are from people who have not won and 'wasted time' sitting in a room, or from people who demand to know when they've been visited. Not everyone can win, nor will a nominations list be made public. Imagine if we did do that? These forums would be loaded with "x should of won, not z! Why wasn't 'i' nominated!?" threads. Winners and nominations are at the judges discretion.

I don't think you understand. The room was built like 6 years ago. I am right.

I did misread that, and I apologize. Neither myself nor others are sure of which room you're referring to. But honestly here, if it happened, it's in the past and there's no reason to call whoever it was out at this moment. Keep in mind, we don't know every single room VMK put out there. Sometimes if it's not brought to our attention, it can obviously get past us. If you see players abusing this in the future, give us a heads up and send us an e-mail with a link to the original room, and the names of the owner and of the new room and we can take a look.
On the other hand, MyVMK copying MyVMK, we catch. So when you think X build his room first and get mad because Z won, you're not always right.


As to the comments about not enough staff being around. No one ever said BGR would be monitored 24/7. But I guarantee you someone is around the majority of the day, whether you see them or not. I for one come on multiple times throughout the day, and every time I am on, I look. If you want to win, and sitting in your room at certain times does not seem to be working for you, try different times. Lack of staff isn't the issue here.

For me to say its not a competition may have been stretching it, but only slightly. Again, YOU make this the competition. We're just randomly looking for great rooms. And you know what? It's a game! Game on! That's how games work. We're offering something for having this amazing room, so you choose to fight for it. But just because you do, does not mean that you are guaranteed to win, or even be nominated. The rules are very vague, because there are no need for rules. I think you are all over thinking this whole process. Being considered for a nomination only requires you to make a room and be in it (again, nominations are at our discretion). There is no set amount of time you need them to be open (WE just think it would be nice to SEE them available for everyone to enjoy), it's not held against you. Sitting in your room alone, also not held against you. When someone questions a room built at the end of the month winning (which is no different than all the entries we would receive the last day of the month, when it WAS open for submissions), well, that's when it all comes down to exactly what the newsletter states. The main purpose of this program. Having a unique/creative room that stands out. And in return, being rewarded. This is NOT a popularity contest! The only ones turning it into one, are the players themselves. Not the judges.

"Player created Guest or Game Rooms demonstrate originality in concept and design. Our judges are looking for creativity, so try using traditional items in different and unique ways. Rooms are judged by MyVMK Staff every month and selected from player rooms.
Create a game room and play with friends and others, and a MyVMK judge may notice your idea! Game rooms that get the nod offer a new game idea or a new twist on an old favorite. In all rooms we look for room owners who welcome everyone with a smile and show a willingness to answer questions about their room."

This will be my last post on this. I am not sure how much more I can explain it without repeating what i've already said multiple times. If you choose to make this a miserable experience, you're only doing it to yourself. The whole purpose of this program is to have fun with it. Not be sour each time a winner is announced and your name is not on that list. There's always the next month!